Aug
28

AoC: Is the hole deeper than I thought?

26 Comments

A couple of days ago, I wrote up an article about the anger in the AoC community. Now, I come across this:

What it boils down to is that Age of Conan just doesn?t provide a unique or meaningful game experience. Characters can level to max level somewhat quickly, yay!, only to be presented with the option of doing absolutely nothing interesting other than leveling yet another character to max level. A certain kudos is in place to Funcom for even failing at the basic treadmill system; for most people, that carrot on the end of the stick (being making another character to keep waiting for the real carrot) didn?t go over to well.

…goodness gracious.

It’s pretty much in line with what I think except he sees really no value in AoC right now, which I don’t completely agree with. Beyond saving? Don’t know. Maybe if you get rid of the less than stellar project management over at Funcom, then AoC will come ou on top of this whirlwind they find themselves in. I also took serious note of the CEO selling off his stock…which is usually a sign of bad things to come for a company, especially when a CEO hasn?t sold any in the past (…6 years in this case…). It’s been my experience that the fatter rats get off the ship first. I really didn’t take much note in the Massively article regarding Funcom’s stock “plummet”. Looking back to 2006, this seems to be a rebalancing of Funcom’s market price to ?normal? values. They had a similar “plummet” back in August of last year and a more gradual loss of stock price in 2006. For some reason, we didn?t care then, but we do now? There really is not enough data for us to say anything about Funcom’s future as a company based on stock price…at least for now.

Regardless…there seems to be a gathering of negative energy that Funcom has mustered around itself and AoC. This title was once highly anticipated and had a pretty good launch…relatively speaking. They’ve been trying to control the news flow a bit with expansion concept art and patch notes (…PvP anyone…??), but so far, it doesn’t seem to be working out.

/grabs popcorn

D out.

Posted in Age of Conan
26 Comments Posted by Darren

26 Responses to "AoC: Is the hole deeper than I thought?"

  • Hudson says:
    August 28, 2008 at 12:34 pm

    This game is in HUGE trouble when WAR launches. Moreso because it will lose its main base, and that is PVP’ers. I dont mean due to WAR IS AWESUM BEST MMO!!!!11 I mean that the core PVP crowd is going to jump ship like it hit and iceberg. Then what is left? PVE players? Give me a break, the PVE in that game is hideous.

    And they announce an expansion? C’mon

  • Tipa says:
    August 28, 2008 at 12:36 pm

    If you added up all the paid subscribers of all SOE’s games, I wonder if you would come close to the number of subscribers Funcom has for just AoC? It’s way too early to write Funcom’s obituary.

    I have no idea, btw, of the subscription numbers for any of SOE’s games. AoC is said to have 400,000.

  • Openedge1 says:
    August 28, 2008 at 12:45 pm

    I recently commented and created a thread on MMORPG which basically states
    “Truly out of touch”

    And it shows.

    From interviews where Erling still discusses launch 4 months after the fact (“We released what some are calling a Miracle Patch”), Famine, their main CM is still discussing launch..
    “I know launch has been stressful”
    A post from 2 days ago, yet, we are 4 MONTHS IN.

    Notice how the wording is “Present Tense”

    All I said was
    “Maybe because after 4 months the game is still not ready, So everyday is a launch when they get up, go to work, and start all over?”

    They may have scrips now, but like Hudson, I feel that they will be gone when WAR launches. Especially since PvP systems ARE STILL NOT IN…

    Sad company!

  • Tipa says:
    August 28, 2008 at 12:46 pm

    @Hudson — many of the most vocal WAR supporters were just as excited about AoC, PotBS, etc. You can’t ever please the crowds that just gravitate to the new shiny. The magpie players. There’s every indication, already seen in play, that PQs are going to become difficult to complete once the player base diffuses through the game. Likely the same for scenarios/battlegrounds. And when Mythic adds back in the four cities they removed, even city conquests might be too spread out to make them viable on a consistent basis. Maybe once the AoC PvP changes finally arrive and the bugs fixed, AoC will turn out to be a better PvP solution that WAR. Maybe every gamer plays WotLK when it comes out and every other game is forgotten, and now the MMO news sites that devote every other article to WAR will shift to oversaturating about WotLK.

    Gawd. This whole fake excitement about every new title makes me sick with disgust. We bloggers lap up marketing bullshit like thirsty cats, and we sit, happy and satiated, until some more marketing types exploit our desperate need for overstimulation with the next marketing blitz.

  • JoBildo says:
    August 28, 2008 at 1:11 pm

    Wowsa, Tipa.

    /hands cookie

    That was a well written explosion of angst. I must say.

    I may very well be one of these “magpie players”, and really I’m okay with that. I like looking forward to new games. I like getting excited about things. I feel bad for those who simply can’t just enjoy the ride anymore.

  • Sente says:
    August 28, 2008 at 1:39 pm

    Let’s see, AoC has sold over 800k copies, they have about 400k subscribers. I recall some number about 40% of WoW players who went to AoC went back to WoW – meaning 60% did not go back. And of those who went back, they might not necessarily have left AoC.

    There is certainly going to be a number of people that will play Warhammer Online when it is released, or play the next WoW expansion. Does not mean they will keep doing that. Give it a couple of months after these releases and one might get some better picture. Until the next shiny gets closer to release, that is…

    Even if AoC looses a bunch more of the subscribers they have now, they are still doing much better than most released MMORPG titles released to date in the Western hemisphere.
    Compare this to Tabula Rasa – NCSoft earned about 2 million USD on the game in Q2 2008. Simplifying the calculation and assuming 15 USD per month and account, that amounts to about 45K players. That is close to their break-even for operational costs. A more accurate calculation would take into account that European pay a higher fee, income from new game sales might be different and some might pay per 6 months and thus might not be included. Still, it might be close enough.

    A year from now, AoC might still be in the top 5 of Western MMORPGs, which is not a bad position.

  • Monk says:
    August 28, 2008 at 1:40 pm

    @Tipa

    Well all of what you just said is pretty much wishful thinking. Maybe all of the stuff warhammer offers will fail at some point . But at least it is in the game and working which for me is the big difference to other games. If the day finally comes where pqs become too hard (although looking at WOW i doubt that will happen) because too few people are in the area it can be patched. And come on scenarios/battlegrounds failing? If thats the case then WOW?s PVP would have died long ago.

    Man if you are annoyed about people getting overexcited for new games i?m annoyed by people that seemingly want them to fail. WAR will work. Not as well as WOW but it definitely will.

  • Tipa says:
    August 28, 2008 at 2:05 pm

    Well, I am pretty sure that in WAR’s case, there will be a PQ per tier that everyone always does. The mechanic they announced that will keep increasing your odds of winning a loot bag from completing a PQ as long as you don’t log off or try another one almost guarantees that — people will just keep doing the same one because there will be plenty of people to get it done, and their chance of the big win goes up each time. So I expect a lot of PQs just will go unused in favor of the popular ones.

    There are LOTS of WAR scenarios. Again, some will become popular and people will go to those because that’s where the people are. Most will go unused because the people are all at the other one.

    And it’s not wishful thinking, I don’t wish for WAR to fail, or for AoC to fail, or for any game to fail. Having choices is good. I just want the blind fanaticism that ALL OF US CONTINUALLY BUY IN TO, to fail. The fanboy shift from AoC to WAR was so fast, it could kill someone if they got too close. It just seems to get worse every time a new game comes around, as we all become BETTER and MORE WILLING tools for MARKETING CAMPAIGNS. We are being manipulated, and we are loving it.

  • Relmstein says:
    August 28, 2008 at 2:16 pm

    I just like to point out that there are some MMO players who are a fan of the combat and graphics in Age of Conan. Warhammer really doesn’t offer anything better in those regards. I’m sure the more advance PvP systems of Warhammer will attract some players away, but I am not sure if they’ll lose another 50% of their subscribers again. Heck, I thought they would be down to 200k by end of July but it looks like I was wrong.

    http://relmstein.blogspot.com/2008/07/did-funcom-lose-money-by-releasing.html

    Age of Conan just released really, really, really unfinished, its not a bad game and I had more fun with it then Tabula Rasa, Vanguard and Lord of the Rings Online. Based on my experience with the preview weekend I liked Warhammer better then Age of Conan, but they both have their charm. I guess the real reason everyone is pissed at Age of Conan was because it promised a lot features which were cut or pushbacked without any official announcements. There might be some justified nerd rage there.

  • Monk says:
    August 28, 2008 at 2:20 pm

    Okay i agree that the way some people switch games is a bit ridiculous. I personally never was that interested in AOC or that Pirate game from seeing just a few videos of these games and instantly deciding that they probably suck or at the least are not what i want from a game.

    Maybe i?m just different that way but i do actually believe that a lot of people were sceptical of WAR for quite some time and waited until actual finished material was available to judge the game. At least i personally waited and did not even preorder it. During the last two weeks I read a lot about it , watched some videos and decided if I liked it based on actual facts. But again maybe thats just me.

    In the end it?s no use getting angry or bitter about it (not implying that you are but it seems like it). Every society get?s what it deserves and the same goes for us gamers. as long as those fanbois exist and follow the hype blindly this stuff will happen. The best we can do is be a voice of reason in blogs/forums like this :)

  • JoBildo says:
    August 28, 2008 at 2:24 pm

    Meh, I made no bones about it long ago that I was looking forward to both games. It only makes sense that I’d start to show my gaming-lust for the one that’s drawing near. It also doesn’t help that I no longer play AoC because at work I’m focused on WAR.

    You forget Tipa that this small section of gamers in our circle is not exactly indicative of the entire gaming populace. You’re always going to see a giant wave of nerds talking amongst ourselves hear, heralding and decrying the next big thing. You should be used to it by now.

  • Tipa says:
    August 28, 2008 at 3:02 pm

    Bildo, you are 100% right. For most western MMO players, the only MMO there is, is WoW, and they view other new MMOs with all the excitement that they would give to someone’s announcement of a new version of Tetris. For most people, when they get tired of WoW, they’ll stop playing MMOs entirely — because they will assume all MMOs are more or less like WoW, and if they ever have a desire to go back to MMOs, they will just resub to WoW.

    We — and I use the term WE to mean all of us, not just any particular site, blogger or commenter — we, with our boundless enthusiasm for new things, seize on things like “we’re not just like WoW because we have TWITCH COMBAT!” and “we’re not just like WoW because we have PUBLIC QUESTS and all this stuff we had in our last game that you probably haven’t heard of but we’re treating it like something new because it’s new to you! Except the ground-breaking innovation of complicating inter-realm rivalry by having a three-sided conflict, we took that out. FOR THE HORDE!”

    I’m no better. I get excited about new games like Wizard 101, Spellborn, Star Trek Online and Champions Online and stuff, so next year is the year you see me go through what all the AoC/WAR/WotLK folks are going through this year. I am SO no better. I just want to approach games with a clear head — not swooned by marketing, but also not burned out so much by previous marketing campaigns that NEVER, NOT ONCE, described the game that actually survives the first rush of players that make it their own, toss out the bad stuff and keep the good. Clear head, calm mind, and games that are genuinely fun on their own terms.

    I was turned off by the mad hype for AoC and am turned off of WAR because of the hype. I have never played the game even once, never seen it played, haven’t even looked at many screenshots, but I can recite for you the feature list along with the pros and cons of each. Saturation marketing has entirely erased whatever joy I might have gotten from finding things out for myself — as a blogger, I am immersed in MMOs to such an extent that the sense of mystery can’t survive it. That’s why I like little games like Wizard101 — *I* get to make the discoveries on my own. I get to figure out how to build my deck. It’s all new to me! Spellborn is likely to be released with almost no marketing push in the US at all — the entire thing will be new! I live for that mystery. The harsh searchlight of saturation marketing and the flittering cloud of fanboy moths that dance in that light — that have ruined WAR for me — misses so many other games worth playing. It’s sad.

    Well, at least nobody cares about EQ or EQ2. The EQ2 expansion is coming out in a couple of months and somehow I have not seen any MMO news sites with complete guides for earning faction mounts from the Guktans in the Moors of Ykesha, along with a complete ranking of quests and guides for performing each one, along with maps, locations and screen overlays. If EQ2 were WAR, these would be old news.

  • Openedge1 says:
    August 28, 2008 at 3:44 pm

    Notice how no one mentions the “HIT” (using that term loosely) LOTRO?

    In just 60+ days (yea, just 2 months) Mines of Moria is coming. Talk about a major mistake to release something in this timeline.

    But, why is no one excited except for the niche crowd that just loves that whole lore thing.
    There were many a blogger who hailed LOTRO as some second coming of casual gaming (even some posting in these comments)
    It is probably one of the biggest Fantasy IP’s in history, yet it sits in the background to all the “fan” noise of WAR.

    But, thanks to no marketing push, everyone totally forgets it exists. Mind you, I know many a reason why it is not being touted either…(I will blame the game itself)..
    But, who can really make themselves known when such hullabaloo is thrown around over a game that has 2 unique features.
    Open groups and RvR.
    And of course because it is the “next big thing”.

    These are not selling points for me. And until I see the game at least look fun to play (combat speeded up) and visuals improved, I see no reason to be excited.

    Runes of Magic should actually be higher on the WoW radar thanks to the fact it has so much in common, yet takes WoW and adds all the things people wish WoW had. And is FREE.

    But, nope, we hear about a game that is…well, just looks ok.

    TCoS should be bandied about thanks to a unique playstyle……all we have is silence.

    And we still have the news of a crap MMO like AoC still filling the webernets.

    Sad stuff.

  • Genda says:
    August 28, 2008 at 4:17 pm

    The fact that this exists … http://www.r1ft.com/wp-content/uploads/fc10.jpg pretty much sums up how a lot of gamers are feeling right now. Today’s gamer doesn’t tolerate disappointment well, and if add obfuscation on top of that, you will likely get them riled. Like FunCom did.

    BTW, am I the only one what has a problem with taking a company with a name like “FunCom” seriously? Every time I see it I expect to see a clown as the mascot or something.

  • Bildo says:
    August 28, 2008 at 6:38 pm

    Another thing that must be remembered is that the videogame industry is swelling, guys. HUGELY swelling. It’s grown past us. It’s grown past what we ever thought it would become as people who grew up playing Atari and Nintendo and DOS games. Guess what a result of this is? MASSIVE pushes in marketing. You can sit back and blog about how you hate the hype, hate the in your face attitude, and wonder where the marketing for smaller games is… but really you’re only adding fuel to the fire.

    The reason smaller games get less hype? They’re like the independent films that critics love but no one goes to, while big giant flashy turds (enjoyable though they may be on the big screen) like Transformers get lunchboxes, snack packs, and cereals.

    This is the world we live in, folks. Get used to it, and learn to ignore it. Because it’s not going anywhere until we’re all locked in a vault somewhere waiting for the bomb to drop.

  • TheRemedy says:
    August 28, 2008 at 11:17 pm

    Totally off-topic, but is there a difference between Bildo and JoBildo?

    @Openedge1

    How is Mines a mistake? Turbine has like 200k subscribers for Lotro and those players have to be appeased. Just because Blizz and Mythic are releasing products that means Turbine shouldn’t keep their players happy? The bigger mistake would be for them to not release a new product in this time frame.

  • Rob says:
    August 28, 2008 at 11:47 pm

    Who wants to come play Vanguard with me? Anyone?

  • JoBildo says:
    August 29, 2008 at 7:07 am

    @TheRemedy:

    Just two letters. :) I posted one reply at work (which has JoBildo saved in the name field) and another at home (which still has Bildo).

  • Scott says:
    August 29, 2008 at 9:27 am

    @TheRemedy: pay no attention to Openedge1 when he mentions LOTRO. He often has things to say, but anytime he mentions LOTRO (usually completely out of the blue in a non-LOTRO conversation) it’s just hate and bile about a game he doesn’t play. Shame, really, because whether I agree with him or not, I find his non-LOTRO conversations interesting reading but his LOTRO-hate has gotten beyond old at this point.

  • Openedge1 says:
    August 29, 2008 at 11:23 am

    Awww…C’mon Scott. I can’t help that a company would take such a big IP and make such a mediocre game. As to out of the blue, actually it has everything to do with this discussion…see below.

    @TheRemedy, yes, surely they can keep their current base happy (which people still question the overall numbers…). Yet, releasing something as big as Moria when the market is inundated with other major MMO releases, I still feel is less than profitable.
    Why release something that would either pull in old subscribers who left or new subscribers with a powerhouse expansion, an item that COULD make them more money, when the market is under a deluge.

    Think of this.

    Turbine has released “free” content to its current subscriber base on a regular basis. This, from my understanding has kept the “current” population happy. So, the argument that this is to “appease” the current crop is truly not the right tact. Why would Turbine only want to please this crowd, when they have something that could possibly bring in MANY more players. This would be a money maker.

    Say WAR plays its hand, and people feel it does not meet their needs after 3-4 months (an average number of players, if they like the game usually go for the cheaper 3 month scrip route). Then LOTRO releases Moria say around Christmas or later. this could prove to be profitable.

    But, this is where their mistake is. And it shows. The number of sites discussing LOTRO compared to the WAR noise, is so small.

    But, just an opinion.

    How does this relate to this post? Who else had a supposedly successful launch, and now wallows in small numbers? As Tipa also stated, how can any other game make any news when the uproar over the hype machine of other MMOs cloud the blogosphere.
    And no matter how much hate I may have for LOTRO (we all need a cause), I for one would like to see if my issues for LOTRO are addressed in MoM. But, trying to find any information is like looking for a Middle Earth needle in a WAR/AoC haystack.

  • Scott says:
    August 29, 2008 at 12:31 pm

    There’s not much talk about it because information has been kept to a minimum, although it sounds like that might be changing next week at PAX. Otherwise, who gets the hype machine rolling for an expansion? AoC and WAR… brand new SHINY (well, the only shine in AoC turned out to be the character skins, blech) games to be excited about. L2 can launch yet another expansion and no one gives a shit. EQ and EQ2 launch expansions every few months, and no one hypes them other than the handful of EQ2 bloggers. WotLK is the exception because WoW itself is the exception; it’s an anomaly in the MMOG marketplace. The signal to noise ratio over WAR to *anything other than WotLK* is minimal, whether any of us like the particular “anything else” game or not.

    I can barely find words to express my dislike for EQ2 but I don’t pop over to the EQ2 forums at MMORPG.com and repeatedly troll the game. I’m happy other people love it. I enjoy the hell out of reading blogs about EQ2 or EVE and other MMOG’s that I dislike playing. It shows me more diversity in the genre and lets me hear of other adventures than yet another re-telling of the same WoW raid everyone and their brother has done umpteen times too. Sure, it’s fun reading other bloggers’ different perspectives on the same adventure I’ve had too, but I so appreciate that there are so many other games out there people are enjoying and writing about.

  • Openedge1 says:
    August 29, 2008 at 4:28 pm

    @Scott
    To your question…who gets the hype machine rolling about an expansion?

    Turbine should for one.

    Moria is a huge setting. Yet, we are still inundated with this news of AoC after 4 months. I still claim the car wreck syndrome there. It should be dying down, but everyone is waiting for the MMOpocalypse of Funcom.

    As to your game comparisons you have chosen, they have less than admirable followings in the US, so no wonder no one knows about L2 or EQ2 expansions. The audience is too small.

    Middle Earth is a whole different story.

    At least it should be.

    A company who can claim 2007 Best RPG of the year, yet cannot garner news about the most beloved setting of Middle Earth?

    I still blame the hype machine.

    As to your comments about reading blogs and mmorpg.com, I am not sure of its purpose in regards to this conversation. I understand its purpose, but I do not believe it belongs here.
    You do note appreciation of the different adventures they present. That I can agree with. But, right now, there are about 5 or 6 I have started to visit less because of the WAR kool aid stains all over them.
    This all boils down to Tipas statement.
    many of the most vocal WAR supporters were just as excited about AoC, PotBS, etc. You can?t ever please the crowds that just gravitate to the new shiny.
    And this causes a ripple effect in the blogs we read. I would like to hear about MoM, or more about TCoS, Runes of Magic. But, all single minded discussion for a game that no one knows for sure will be THAT good on release is troublesome.

    Maybe we should all make a change and let the shiny sell itself instead of the fanaticism we see right now.

  • Scott says:
    August 29, 2008 at 4:46 pm

    I’ll whole-heartedly agree with Tipa, and you as well there about the whole WAR fanaticism. Even after “coming around” and pre-ordering WAR, I’m not necessarily looking forward to WAR itself. I want to see how PQ’s work, and if the game manages to meld PvE and PvP together in a way that is meaningful and fun (for me). Mostly I’m looking forward to the CoW guild. But between the fanboys, the negativity, the hype saturation and my belief that PvP MMO’s attract the unsavory players, I’m already getting that twitch in my neck that may prognosticate an intense dislike for the game.

  • Pithius says:
    September 2, 2008 at 1:24 pm

    Wow, I really do feel this guy’s pain. I haven’t played AoC, but in reading the post mortem I couldn’t help but be reminded of my own nerd-rage towards SOE during the whole Star Wars Galaxies fiasco. The parallels are uncanny. The promised content which wasn’t there. The obfuscation and lying from the developers. The continued claims from the developers of having a wonderful launch with hundreds of thousands of people and the hemorraging of over half those initial subscribers within a month or two. The cries of “Fix what is broken” before coming up with an expansion. How “fixes” would introduce more bugs than they fixed. Oh, so many memories. This guy is a true fan. It takes a lot of love for a game to inspire that much hate towards the developers who have screwed things up. Unless there is a fundamental change in Funcom’s attitude I’m afraid that this game is beyond saving.

  • Jake says:
    September 7, 2008 at 4:16 am

    They’re in deep, that’s for sure… and in 4 months have showed NO signs they intend to attempt to dig themselves out, introducing patches which fix bugs that nobody really saw often, instead of things like memory leaks, and desktop crashes which have plagued the game since beta. They continue to NOT communicate with their playerbase, which is perhaps the MOST important thing that a company running an online game can do wrong.

    I will never, simply based on AoC, purchase another Funcom product… their community is atrocious, their game, while entertaining at first, loses it’s appeal after a couple of months, and their tech support, and customer service is the worst I’ve seen in a very, very long time.

    6 or 7 years ago, what they’re doing may have flown, but it’s 2008… they have a game that looks like it was built in 2008, and it’s about time they supported it like it WAS 2008, instead of 1999, or 2000. WoW did some bad things, and good things for the industry, but one of the things it did was raise the bar as far as standards for release were concerned. AoC not only didn’t meet those standards, it was so far below standards on everything but graphics, and sound, that it actually lowered the bar a bit IMO.

    Now, WAR just has to launch better than AoC, to be considered a success… which is a bit sad IMO.

Leave a Comment