Jun
24

Again…me playing with fire

19 Comments

Going to keep this as short as possible.

Richard Bartle….he’s is 100% correct.

That is all.

D out.

Posted in Blah blah
19 Comments Posted by Darren

19 Responses to "Again…me playing with fire"

  • sid67 says:
    June 24, 2008 at 10:46 am

    Tobold was critical of him and he posted a response there as well:
    http://tobolds.blogspot.com/2008/06/public-figures.html

    I honestly don’t know why this guy is such a big deal, but apparently he is…

  • Thallian says:
    June 24, 2008 at 11:09 am

    Thanks for the linkage D. Seems pretty lucid to me. I think what is going on here is some people were a little too easily offended.

  • DanM says:
    June 24, 2008 at 11:12 am

    He’s the guy that wrote the original MUD, the text-based antecedent of today’s MMOs, waaaay back in the day. Since then, he’s done a bunch of academic work around multiplayer gaming, particularly the social and non-computing aspects of it. He wrote a book, Designing Virtual Worlds, that’s got a pretty good take on player psychology and things to take into consideration when designing multiplayer games; it’s fairly thought-provoking if you’re into multiplayer game design.

    Is he the final word on multiplayer gaming? No, not by a long shot. But he’s thought about it from a perspective different from most players, and taken in that context, his comments make a lot of sense. He’s generally right about it, too. Warhammer’s an iteration on the formula established by EQ (and before that, the MU*s from text-based days) and polished to a shiny diamond by WoW. Sure, it’s got some new stuff, but there’s nothing that overturns the apple cart. Why should there be? Legions of gamers are willing to pay and dedicate significant chunks of time and effort to that model, and the games are designed to make money.

    I don’t understand the hostility generally to it. It’s not as if he *can* turn WoW off, or that he’ll have any impact on Warhammer beyond giving it a bit of publicity. The furor in the blagosphere is hilarious.

  • Richard Bartle says:
    June 24, 2008 at 11:59 am

    DanM>The furor in the blagosphere is hilarious.

    Not to me it isn’t (sigh).

    Richard

  • DanM says:
    June 24, 2008 at 12:09 pm

    Well, here’s hoping the indie guys can come up with some new and interesting takes on virtual worlds, and that those takes will catch the attention of at least SOME folks.

    EVE Online’s continuity seems to suggest there’s at least some market out there for games with a different take, though the depth of that market’s a question. Maybe there’s a niche for “large-scale” multiplayer games, where you aim to support 300 or 3,000 players in a world rather than 300,000. Maybe it’s time to turn it the other way, and make games targeted to smaller groups–worlds tailored for 5-10 players, with the ability for players to have real influence on the world’s development.

    Ah, hope springs eternal.

  • Darren says:
    June 24, 2008 at 12:33 pm

    @ Richard. First…hi. Second…2nd rule of the internet: never take bloggers seriously, especially when you state something that is, quite honestly, very obvious. At the very least, it deserves serious thought, not a mob reaction

  • Darren says:
    June 24, 2008 at 12:39 pm

    …addendum @ Richard: Just don’t say anything about the NGE and you’ll be fine ;)

  • Exeter says:
    June 24, 2008 at 12:51 pm

    The ‘furor’ isn’t hilarious, it’s ridiulous because it’s simply a knee-jerk reaction to the simple fact that in the end, we all know and are simply loathe to admit that Webkinz (et al) is the future!

    Enjoy your revolution :p

    @Darren – O.o NGE? Hulk Smash! :D

  • DanM says:
    June 24, 2008 at 12:59 pm

    The furor is hilarious *because* it’s ridiculous. Watching people get frothy over pixels is always eternally amusing.

  • Exeter says:
    June 24, 2008 at 1:06 pm

    @DanM – Amen to that, bruddah. Amen.

  • sam says:
    June 24, 2008 at 2:08 pm

    @danm

    I’m not sure if its the new casual gamers that wow brought in can’t admit that all the time they spent playing a video game was just liesure time down the drain. Or if it’s the hardcore gamers freaking out over the fact that thier universe is changing.

    But there is a lot more anger and hysteria about gaming after the last year of duds.

  • sam says:
    June 24, 2008 at 2:10 pm

    @ richard.

    Don’t be to upset over all the fuss at least people are still paying attention to what you say.

  • krones says:
    June 24, 2008 at 2:48 pm

    *grabs a flamethrower*

  • Tom says:
    June 24, 2008 at 3:56 pm

    @ Richard and Original Post

    One thing I have noticed on Brokentoys and other blogs is that the readers only take what Richard says at face value. They don’t actually “listen” and think about what was said. When I first read some of the points he has made I instantly went gamer mode and thought “This old man needs to go away”. But then I remembered who was talking. Richard your interviews, posts and comments about subjects always seem to make the “blogosphere” erupt in ways no other can.

    Thank you for that.

  • Keen says:
    June 24, 2008 at 8:58 pm

    NGE was exactly what SWG needed, Vanguard was a booming success, WOTLK will be a flop, and Bartle is 100% correct.

    All true, really.

  • saylah says:
    June 24, 2008 at 11:30 pm

    I’m actually shocked at the responses Bartle’s (B) comment unleashed. What I don’t like about Tolbold’s post are his huge assumptions. How would he know if B is bitter? Moreover, it’s rather audacious to tie it to monetary success because he has no way of knowing what B makes OR how he himself measures his own success. Then the bit about him being irrelevant is based on more assumptions. Irrelevant to who? The only person Tobold can answer tgat question for is himself. The fact that B is still interviewed means that he clearly isn’t irrelevant. Funny thing is that many people have said that WAR=WOW re-skinned. If B saying it can shake this many trees, it’s just one more counter to the “he’s irrelevant” characterization. The whole post could have been done without making personal attacks. But oh well, the interwebs will move on at some point.

  • yunk says:
    June 25, 2008 at 8:32 am

    I also don’t really get why people are upset. Especially the ones who try to read his mind and tell him why he does things. What’s up with that?

  • Ethic says:
    June 25, 2008 at 10:37 am

    Of all the people in the industry I have met, Richard is at the top of the list of people I’d listen to speak over and over again. His insights on the industry are very much on the money. People tend to pick out little statements he makes without understanding the big picture he is painting. I have yet to disagree with anything he has said, in the context of how it was said.

  • Exeter says:
    June 25, 2008 at 11:31 am

    Ethic said – “People tend to pick out little statements he makes without understanding the big picture he is painting.”

    I suppose not having followed Mr. Bartle’s work, and simply going off what was said in the interview, puts me at somewhat of a disadvantage because I, as a gamer and not as someone ‘in the industry’, don’t feel that there’s even a picture being painted for the future. There’s a call for change, nay, revolution and then there’s much wielding of box-cutters over the portrait of the Mona Lisa.

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